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Joe the Bartender
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PostSubject: Production   Thu Apr 16, 2015 4:26 am

Here's my current production list for the unit tweaks I'm doing. Included are a couple of propositions (such as giving the Minotaurs the Chaos Dragon). If I've missed anything (which I probably have Wink) or should change something, let me know.


Barbarians
Resource Structure: Metal, Gold/Stone, Crystal

Fortress 1: Thrall
Scout Tower: Eagle Eye 1-3
Camp: Barbarian, Rider (Corral), Warlord (Corral + Chieftain's Hut), Wardog (Fortress 2), Reaver (Fortress 5)

Fortress 2
Mill: Income 1-3, Trade
Corral: Horsemaster, Horselord, Rearing, Trampling
Nest 1: Eagle

Fortress 3
Altar of Tempest: Lightning Hawk, Berserk, Magical Tattoos, Bloodlust, Summon Mana 1-3, Tempest (Fortress 5)

Fortress 4
Chieftain's Hut: Horde 1-9
Nest 2: Pegasus

Fortress 5
Nest 3: Storm Dragon, Swamp Dragon


Daemons
Resource Structure: Crystal, Metal, Gold, Stone

Doomkeep 1:Quasit
Pit: Imp, Nightmare (Doomkeep 2), Succubus (Portal), Reaper (Gallows), Salamander (Doomkeep 3), Daemon (Portal + Chaos Shrine), Summoner (Doomkeep 5)

Doomkeep 2
Gallows: Hard Labor 1-3
Portal: Binding, Might of Ctharos, Infernal Fury, Daemonic Sight 1-2, Dark Wind
Brood 1: Firebat

Doomkeep 3
Summoning Tower 1: Brood, Summoning 1
Lighting Spire: Stormcall

Doomkeep 4
Summoning Tower 2: Summoning 2, Gate 1
Lightning Spire 2
Brood 2: Harpy
Chaos Shrine: Intangibility 1-2, Summon Mana (Doomkeep 5), Balora (Doomkeep 5)

Doomkeep 5
Summoning Tower 3: Gate 2
Brood 3: Fire Dragon, Chaos Dragon


Dark Elves
Resource Structure: Crystal, Stone, Metal/Gold

Dark Tower 1: Will O Wisp
Tree of Pain: Dark Infantry, Dark Archer (Cielos), Dark Rider (Animos), Sorcerer (Manos), Spider Priestess (Animos + Manos), Assassin (Mortos), Blackguard (Dark Tower 5)
Tomb: Skeleton, Spider, Queen Spider, Black Ward 1-3, Burial
Grave (Burial): Skeleton

Dark Tower 2: Ancient Wisp, Rune of Animos
Gallery: Fletcher, Bowyer, Flaming Arrows
Brood 1: Umbral Phoenix

Dark Tower 3: Rune of Manos
Reformatory: Blood Potion, The Dark Order, Slavehorde
Void: Summon Mana 1-3, Sorcery 1-2, Darkbolt, Sacrifice

Dark Tower 4: Rune of Mortos
Kargothian Gate: Meditation 1-3, Kargoth (Dark Tower 5)
Brood 2: Harpy

Dark Tower 5
Brood 3: Storm Dragon, Dragonliche


Dark Dwarves
Resource Structure: Stone, Metal, Gold, Crystal

Furnace 1: Weaponsmith 1-2, Armorer 1-2, Mithril (Weaponsmith 2 + Armorer 2)
Trader
Guild: Engineer, Alchemist Fire 1-2 (Furnace 3 & 4 respectively), Siegecraft (Furnace 3), Forge (Furnace 2)
Hall of Golems: Stone Golem, Iron Golem (Siege Workshop), Bronze Golem (Furnace 5), Shatter, Iron Fist, Bronze General, Grond (Furnace 5)

Furnace 2
Trader: Income 1-2, Trade, Spare Parts
Siege Workshop: Ballista, Battering Ram, Firebomb (Furnace 3), Catapult (Furnace 3), Flame Cannon (Furnace 4), Hellbore (Furnace 4)
Eyrie 1: Frostbat

Furnace 3
Ancestral Hall: Wraith (Ancestral Spirit), Earthpower, Ancestral Spirit, Forgotten Power
Supply Depot
Mortar

Furnace 4
Eyrie 2: Wyvern, Golden Wyvern

Furnace 5
Eyrie 3: Fire Dragon, Frost Dragon


Dwarves
Resource Structure: Metal, Gold, Stone, Crystal

Citadel 1: Palace Messenger
Foundry: Dwarf Smith, Ballista, Catapult (College), Battering Ram (College), Weaponsmith 1-2, Armorer 1-2, Mithril (Weaponsmith 2, Armorer 2)
Armory: Dwarf Runner, Dwarf Infantry (Foundry), Dwarf Crossbow (Workshop), Dwarf Berserker (Brewery), Khazrimi Guard (College), Dwarf Lord (Citadel 5)

Citadel 2
Trading Post: Income 1-3, Trade
Workshop: Fletcher, Bowyer
Eyrie 1: Eagle

Citadel 3: Royal Messenger
Brewery: Morale 1-3, Dwarven Brew
Mortar

Citadel 4
College: Runelord, Masonry, Engineering, Siegecraft
Eyrie 2: Griffon

Citadel 5
Eyrie 3: Fire Dragon, Storm Dragon


Empire
Resource Structure: Gold, Metal, Stone, Crystal

Palace 1: Peasant, Palace Guard
Blacksmith: Catapult (Library), Battering Ram (Library), Weaponsmith 1-2, Armorer 1-2
Barracks: Pikeman, Archer (Quartermaster), Halberdier (Archway)

Palace 2
Granary: Supply 1-4, Income 1-2
Quartermaster: Mercenary, Foreign Mercenary 1, Foreign Mercenary 2 (Palace 3), Foreign Mercenary 3 (Palace 5), Trade, Fletcher, Bowyer, Flaming Arrows
Eyrie: Eagle

Palace 3: Royal Guard
Archway: Morale 1-3, Fame 1-3, Lion Throne (Palace 5)

Palace 4
Library: White Mage, Blue Mage, Red Made, Black Mage (Palace 5), Spell Research, Arcane Research, Mysticism 1-2
Eyrie 2: Griffon

Palace 5: Imperial Guard
Eyrie 3: Frost Dragon, Swamp Dragon
Barn: Elephant


Fey
Resource Structure: Crystal, Gold, Stone, Metal

Dreamhold 1: Oakman, Sylph
Orb of Wonder: Lore 1-9 (3, 4 & 5 Dreamhold 3, 6 & 7 Dreamhold 4, 8 & 9 Dreamhold 5)
Faerie Ring: Faerie Blade, Faerie Fire (Dreamhold 4), Faerie Sight, Knights of Faerie, Panoply 1-3 (1 Dreamhold 2, 2 Dreamhold 4, 3 Dreamhold 5), Zephyr 1-3 (2 Dreamhold 3, 3 Dreamhold 5)

Dreamhold 2: Spriggan
Magic Pool: Faerie Dragon, Eagle Eye 1-3, Farseeing (Eagle Eye 3)
Nest 1: Lightning Hawk

Dreamhold 3: Sprite
Rainbow: Leprchaun, Income 1-4 (4 Dreamhold 5)

Dreamhold 4: Pixie
Unicorn Grove: Unicorn, Alicorn, Forestmaster (Dreamhold 5)
Tome: Meditation 1-2, Summon Mana 1-2
Nest 2: Pegasus

Dreamhold 5: Banshee
Nest 3: Swamp Dragon, Celestial Dragon


High Elves
Resource Structure: Crystal, Metal, Gold, Stone

White Tower 1: Lodestar Wisp
Tree of Gold: Iceguard, Longbow (Cielos), Dragon Knight (Animos), Mystic (Manos), Ice Maiden (Cielos + Manos), Moonguard (White Tower 5)
Healer: Healing 1-2, Elcor's Balm

White Tower 2: Ancient Wisp, Rune of Animos
Merchant: Income 1-3, Trade
Shooting Range: Manticore, Fletcher, Bowyer, Flaming Arrows
Nest 1: Halcyon Phoenix

White Tower 3: Rune of Manos
Tower of the Moon: Holy Relic, Rites of Dawn, Holy Word, King Lunarion (White Tower 5)
Dragon Shrine: Dragon Warriors, Knights of the Dragon 1-3

White Tower 4: Rune of Vivos
Dragonstone: Unnamed Mini Celestial Dragon? (Rune of Vivos), Meditation 1-3
Nest 2: Pegasus

White Tower 5
Nest 3: Frost Dragon, Celestial Dragon


Knights
Resource Structure: Metal, Gold, Crystal/Stone

Keep 1: Peasant, Crusade 1-5 (2 Keep 2, 3 Keep 3, 4 Keep 4, 5 Keep 5)
Smithy: Catapult (Order of the Ram), Battering Ram (Order of the Ram), Weaponsmith 1-2, Armorer 1-2, Full Plate Armor (Armorer 2)
Garrison: Swordsman, Squire

Keep 2
Market: Income 1-3, Trade
Fletcher: Fletcher, Bowyer, Flaming Arrows
Stables: Knight, Cavalier (Shrine of the Sword), Paladin (Cathedral), Warhorse
Eyrie 1: Eagle

Keep 3
Shrine of the Sword: Dancing Sword, Inquisitor (Keep 5), Order of the Dragon, Order of the Pegasus, Order of the Grail, Order of the Lion, Order of the Ram, Order of the Rose, Knight's Quest

Keep 4
Cathedral: Archon, Sirian (Keep 5), Holy Relic, Rites of Dawn, Holy Word, Paladin, Grand Paladin (Paladin)
Eyrie 2: Pegasus

Keep 5
Eyrie 3: Fire Dragon, Celestial Dragon


Minotaurs
Resource Structure: Metal, Gold, Stone, Crystal

Ziggurat 1: Thrall, Hand of Sartek
Lookout: Eagle Eye 1-3, Farseeing (Eagle Eye 3)
Arena: Minotaur, Minotaur Axethrower (Axe of Sartek), Gnoll (Pen)
Ironworks: Catapult, Battering Ram, Iron-Clad Horns, Iron-Shod Hooves (Iron-Clad Horns), Shield of Sartek 1-2

Ziggurat 2: Axe of Sartek
Pen: Basilisk, Sheep
Eyrie: Bat

Ziggurat 3: Wind of Sartek
Altar of Sartek: Skull of Sartek (Ziggurat 5), Berserk, Summon Mana 1-3
Ale Store: Morale 1-3, Dwarven Brew

Ziggurat 4: Rage of Sartek
Henge: Minotaur Shaman, Minotaur King (Spirit of Sartek), Shaman
Eyrie 2: Griffon

Ziggurat 5: Spirit of Sartek
Eyrie 3: Chaos Dragon, Storm Dragon


Orcs
Resource Structure: Metal, Stone, Gold, Crystal

Orchold 1: Kobold
Goblin Tower: Goblin, Goblin Chief (Orchold 3), Gobshooter (Battleyard), Eagle Eye 1-3
Battleyard: Orc, Kobold Sniper, Ogre (Ogrelord), Giant (Giantlord), Gornak Elfeater (Orchold 5), Training, Gladiators, No Pain!, Cowards!

Orchold 2
Hovel
Beast Pit: Wolfrider, Wolfpack 1-3, Rabies
Brood 1: Bat

Orchold 3: Ogrelord
Prison: Troll, Slavehord

Orchold 4:
Shaman's Hut: Goblin Shaman, Shaman
Totem (Shaman)
Brood 2: Harpy

Orchold 5: Giantlord
Brood 3: Fire Dragon, Swamp Dragon


Plaguelords
Resource Structure: Crystal, Gold, Metal, Stone

Hall of Plague 1: Contagion 1-5 (1 Hall of Plague 1, 2 Hall of Plague 2, 3 Hall of Plague 3, 4 Hall of Plague 4, 5 Hall of Plague 5)
Cess Pool: Zombie, Ghoul, Slime
Laboratory: Acid 1-3, Fever 1-3, Mutation 1-3

Hall of Plague 2
Plague Pile: Bone Catapult (Hall of Plague 3)
Temple of Eyes: Gazer, Spore (Casket), Flamer (Hall of Plague 4), Speed of Oros, Anger of Oros
Brood 1: Dragonfly

Hall of Plague 3
Casket: Virus 1-3
Hydra Cave: Hydra, Ice Cave (Hall of Plague 4)

Hall of Plague 4
Plague Shrine: Plague Priest (Hall of Plague 5), Summon Mana 1-3
Brood 2: Wyvern
Ice Cave: Hydra, Cryohydra, Fire Cave (Hall of Plague 5)

Hall of Plague 5: Lord Antharg
Brood 3: Chaos Dragon, Swamp Dragon
Fire Cave: Hydra, Cryohydra, Pyrohydra


Ssrathi
Resource Structure: Stone/Metal, Crystal, Gold

Sun Temple 1: Rites of Dawn
Worker Sect: Chameleon, Construction, Deflection, Blending
Warrior Sect: Snakeman, Lizard Rider (Hatchery)

Sun Temple 2: Warmth
Religious Sect: Snakepriest, Naga (Sun Temple 5)
Nest 1: Dragonfly

Sun Temple 3: Couatl's Favor
Sacred Pool: Meditation 1-3, Power of Couatl 1-3
Hatchery: Basilisk, Triceratops, Tyrannosaurus Rex (Saurus Pen)

Sun Temple 4: Couatl's Wrath
Scrying Pool: Eagle Eye 1-3, Farseeing (Eagle Eye 3)
Nest 2: Pterodactyl

Sun Temple 5: Iriki
Saurus Pen: Mind Link, Rage 1-3, Speed 1-3
Nest 3: Fire Dragon, Swamp Dragon


Swarm
Resource Structure: Metal, Stone, Gold, Crystal

Dunekeep 1: Famine 1-4 (2 Dunekeep 2, 3 Dunekeep 3, 4 Dunekeep 4)
Hive 1: Ant, Hive 2 (Dunekeep 2)
Burial Hall: Husk, Bone Catapult

Dunekeep 2
Egg Chamber: Incubation 1-9
Brood 1: Wasp
Hive 2: Scorpion

Dunekeep 3
Watcher: Eagle Eye 1-3, Farseeing (Eagle Eye 3)
Hive 3: Scarab

Dunekeep 4
Queen: Morale 1-3, Fertility
Shrine of Melkor: Summon Mana 1-3, Melkor's Curse, Melkor's Blessing
Brood 2: Harpy
Hive 4: Scorpionman

Dunekeep 5: Lord Melkor
Brood 3: Chaos Dragon, Fire Dragon
Hive 5: Scorpion Priest


Undead
Resource Structure: Gold, Metal, Crystal, Stone

Deathkeep 1: Feast of Garok
Graveyard: Skeleton, Skeleton Cavalry, Burial
Grave (Burial): Skeleton
Boneyard: Bone Catapult (Deathkeep 4), Weaponsmith 1-2, Dark Mithril (Weaponsmith 2)

Deathkeep 2: Tombguard
Barrow: Wraith, Shadow (Altar of Shadows), Haunting, Wailing
Brood 1: Bat

Deathkeep 3: Vampire Bats
Altar of Shadows: Summon Mana 1-3
Cage: Torture, Fallen Knight, Slavehorde (Summon 4 Engineers)

Deathkeep 4: Dark Citadel
Black Library: Spell Research, Arcane Research, Staff of Damnation, Liche King, Vampire (Deathkeep 5), Lord Bane (Deathkeep 5)
Brood 2: Harpy

Deathkeep 5: Dark Lord
Brood 3: Dragonliche, Frost Dragon


Wood Elves
Resource Structure: Crystal, Stone, Metal, Gold

Haven 1: Wisp, Rune of Cielos
Tree of Life: Forestguard, Gladewarden (Cielos), Woodrider (Animos), Elven Hunter (Cielos + Animos), Druid (Manos), Treant (Haven 3), Ancient Treant (Arbos), Dryad (Haven 5), Ironbark (Haven 5), Oakman?
Healing Orb: Healing 1-3, Elcor's Balm
Forest Tower: Eagle Eye 1-3, Farseeing (Eagle Eye 3)

Haven 2: Ancient Wisp, Rune of Animos
Ranger's Guild: Fletcher, Bowyer, Flaming Arrows, Bowmaster
Nest 1: Phoenix

Haven 3: Rune of Manos
Hostel: Morale 1-3, Trade

Haven 4: Rune of Arbos
Magic Well: Meditation 1-3
White Tree: Thorns, Barkskin, Mighty Oaks
Nest 2: Griffon

Haven 5
Nest 3: Storm Dragon, Celestial Dragon


Last edited by Joe the Bartender on Fri Apr 17, 2015 7:50 am; edited 2 times in total
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PostSubject: Re: Production   Thu Apr 16, 2015 6:24 am

With this upgrade, seems that TPC has no original buildings left aside now? That is great. New units? Outstanding! Troll, leprechaun, wraith and shadow strikes back? Yes! BTW Celestial Gold Dragon could be a good name (unless something more interesting comes out of brainstorming. Also dragonstone is a good place for it). Paladin and Cavalier are proper/better names for Knighs. I also like the idea that every Titan has their proper building (shouldn’t be all on palace5, for strategically reasons. But if gornak moves away from orchold5, then the new hint on orc chapter turns out to be pointless). A fire cave can produce all hydras? That should turns the game even more awesome when playing with the plague. Basilisks with ssrathi is a great idea.

Now, some things in my opinion could be better, like:

1- Daemons: it is cool to see a summmoner only producible at higher levels, but I think with very low time production (don’t know if costs will rise) daemons are massive opponents. I guess it will be cool to see summoners at level 4 and daemons at level 5? Perhaps this doesn’t make any sense for you, but it’s my idea of turning daemon unit as an ultimate beast (if they continue to have the same characteristics as they have now).

2-Dark elf: Is there any way to return Spider Pristess to the tombs (and keeping skeletons)? Having not all units in the same building allows a quick production rate don’t you think? IMO Chaos dragon-dragonliche was a hell of a combination for them (perfect I say).

3-dwarves: I like the idea that dwarf smith could be produced at citadel1 (this applies to all builders as well, like zombies for the plague, chamaleons and engineers for strategically reasons). Axe throwing upgrade is not there. Could it be at level 2?

4-Is not Night Dragon ready yet? (not sure where Kharn would like to see it)

5-Knights: I would change inquisitor with sirian production place.

6-minotaurs: ziguratt1 has no animals (although there are sheep at pen)? I’m repeating myself but what about horses (BTW select speech could be the same as AAPEOrder1 aka Pegasus)?

7-Orc: I feel sad for not seeing a ogre chieftain as regular unit… (I would substitute gornak space at battleyard amd move gornak to orchold)

8-plague: my major concern is with resource cost. I like plague piles to be home of catapults, I think zombies should go back to hall1, eye of oros should be producible at temple of eyes as it is now (0.8.4).

9-Ssrathi: chamaleons should go back to sun temple1

10-swarm: if possible melkor to be produced at his shrine and change scorpion man to hive5 and scorpion priest to hive4? Ants to dunkeep only.

11-undead: why does slavehord for the undead summons 4 engineers and for Dark elfs are thralls? Vampires were good at the library.

12- woodies: gladewarden and elven hunter were good at ranger’s guild (the same thing as spider priestess: it can increase the unit production rate). oakman for wood elfs is a good concept. what about make it producible at white trees or it could be summoned be ancient treant (to match the sorcerors with summon zombies).

EDIT: 13-Dark dwarf: engineers back to furnace1. Shadows are gone. Who could fill the gap? A gold golem?

14-Empire:elephants should be available only at level 5.


Last edited by Zetoo on Thu Apr 16, 2015 5:24 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : suggesting summon oakman for the wood elfs (point 12))
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PostSubject: Re: Production   Fri Apr 17, 2015 7:41 am

Yep, everything should be back in the game now Smile. The only troublesome unit should be the Troll. Wraiths, Shadows, Treants and Leprechauns have been sorted out.

1 should hopefully be sorted out now. All the units cost a lot more than they're worth (that said Summoning 2 may counteract that too much), but it does need to be tested out more. Due to the super fast unit production times, the Summoning 1 research is pointless at present. Whilst on the topic of Daemons, I was also thinking about renaming the Summoner to Diabolist, allowing the production of Souls at the Gallows/Chaos Shrine for 150 Crystal & 60 time and swapping the Imp and the Reaper around so the Daemons start with an actual basic infantry unit.

2- Maybe... I'd personally like to see a new unit over that Skeleton myself though it's likely not possible at present. Moving the Spider Priestess to the Tomb sounds reasonable, though if that's done I'd like to see similar changes for the High Elves and Wood Elves too. With the Chaos Dragon, the reason I wouldn't like to see it with the Dark Elves is because they're more Lawful Evil than Chaotic Evil by D&D terms. Their evil is precise and calculated as opposed to Daemons or Minotaurs. Before I finalise anything with the Chaos Dragon though, I'd like a go-ahead from Kharn (after all it's his unit pirat).

3- Another maybe lol!. It certainly would speed up their construction/mine filling though whether they need it or not at the moment I don't know yet. Axe Throwing however has been taken out as it's broken, even with the new unit balancing. It's like giving a permanent Firebreath spell to all Dwarf Infantry at almost no additional cost. However if the old Dwarf Infantry model came back, an Axethrower unit could be made easily enough.

4- Dunno. I'd like to see a golden melee dragon similar to the one being ridden by King Lunarion as a counterpart Smile.

5- Done!

6- I'm a little concerned that Geese could end up becoming a significantly cheaper Farsight which is really hard to stop since units/buildings don't react to critters. I'm also thinking whether Cows can replace Sheep at the Pen, it could make more sense... maybe?

7- I think it would end up doing the same thing as an Ogre and the Orcs already have loads of units anyway. I was thinking it could be a cool hero model or special character though.

8- Done the Hydras and the Eye of Oros (Hydra Crystal costs have been turned to Stone). Zombies at the Hall of Plague will need further looking at imo, same as the Dwarves.

Other ideas I've got for the Plaguelords include changing the Flamers colour to green and giving it green firebreath which inflicts disease. Gazers can also be recoloured and made into a spitter which diseases opponents at range.

Hydras, Cryohydras and Pyrohydras have been tagged as dragons tag rather than monsters. Once the Dragonlords have been drafted up in 9.0.0, I could honestly see the Hydras moving over to them. I know they were created by Antharg, but I say nuts to that. Hydras clearly aren't riddled with eyes, foaming with pus or have maggots coming out of every pore. They're way too draconic and clean in appearance. They really need to look like this.

9- I would like this too but then the Worker Sect becomes a bit useless Sad.

10- Melkor has been shifted. Giant Ants same as Dwarves/Plaguelords, I'm not sure it's necessary yet but will look into it. Scorpionmen/Scorpionpriests will likely remain in their current positions. Does anyone know what the Scartauri were/are? Are they the beta name for the Scorpionmen/Scorpionpriests or maybe even the old name for the Swarm race? If so, I'd like to rename Scorpionmen to Scartauri and Scorpionpriests to Scartauri Priests. I'd also be interested in seeing Spiders & Queen Spiders in the Swarm. Mechanically they fit perfectly, but in terms of lore I have no idea.

11- Vampires moved to Library. The Undead's Slavehorde should summon Engineers for lore reasons. Dark Dwarves were enslaved and are used for most construction and smithy work (such as Dark Mithril I assume).

12- Possibly. Summoning Oakmen sounds cool Smile. I always thought Oakmen fit the Wood Elves more than the the Fey.

13- Same as Dwarves/Plaguelords/Swarm. I don't think there is a gap - Dark Dwarves are doing fine with just the Wraith Smile. Buffed up Dark Dwarf Shadows were pretty horrible. Having access to a unit which covers up the vulnerabilities of the player's entire army is nuts. If any new units are made for the Dark Dwarves, they shouldn't have resistance to Fire or maybe even Electrical. It would be like the Undead having access to Crushing-resistant units for example.

14- Done! In addition, Granaries give +3 unit cap and Barns give +2 unit cap (was +2 and +4 respectively in 1.03).

Wisps (inc Will O Wisps & Lodestar Wisps), Ancient Wisps, all eyes, Banshees, Wraiths & Shadows tagged as extraplanar as they're all various forms of spirits or summons from another plane.

Lastly, I'd like to rename the four riders to Bane, Melkor, Antharg and Sartek rather than Lord Bane, Lord Melkor, Lord Antharg and Lord Sartek. Lord lord, lord lord lord... lord lord lord lord?
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PostSubject: Re: Production   Fri Apr 17, 2015 4:52 pm

Keep up the good work!

Positive things – New Green flamer with infected attack (insane, in a good way. Another eyes could born if all hydras move to dragons), golden melee dragon (can you simply remove Lunarion? That would be a match to Night dragon).  Cows for minotaurs instead of sheep.

Negative points - I don’t like Diabolist new name… and cannot think something better than Summoner.
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PostSubject: Re: Production   Fri Apr 17, 2015 10:18 pm

Well, in terms of lore, spider priestesses are worshipers of Arachnea, the spider goddess. Kargoth is but the strongest dark-elf male worshiper of her, brought to the rank of Champion (I think) through a ritual which also gives him power and spider body. Each 1000 years, Arachnea devours her champion (Kargoth) and a new champion is chosen. I'm sure there's more to it than this, but that's all I can remember. Thus being said, Spider Priestesses are strongly bonded with dark elves (or rather the other way around). I can see spider critters joining the swarm though, but maybe recoloured versions? (the current ones look like tropical spiders, not desert ones).

The Scartauri were later renamed to The Swarm. It is a definition of the creature that is half man half insect only though (not all the units The Swarm has).

Renaming the titans is fine by me. You should do so... In Sartek's name!

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PostSubject: Re: Production   Sun Apr 26, 2015 5:19 am

Patrick_the_Winekiller wrote:
I can see spider critters joining the swarm though, but maybe recoloured versions?

I will see what can be done when I get the time Arrow. Any thoughts on tiny melee Scarabs and Scorpions spawned by the bigger ones kind of like a Queen Spider?

Patrick_the_Winekiller wrote:
The Scartauri were later renamed to The Swarm. It is a definition of the creature that is half man half insect only though (not all the units The Swarm has).

Would you mind if I renamed the Scorpionman to Scartauri and Scorpionpriest to Scartauri Priest?

Zetoo wrote:
New Green flamer

I was thinking that it would replace the Flamer for the Plaguelords. Maybe the normal firey one can be a summon in a new spellbook? I don't like the current Plaguelords side, they feel like an elemental disco party with some dragon creatures thrown in.
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PostSubject: Re: Production   Sun Apr 26, 2015 5:47 am

Joe the Bartender wrote:
I was thinking that it would replace the Flamer for the Plaguelords. [...]

It could work… Experimentation is the mother of all things. And yes! I would like to see lots of new spells/spellbooks/trees of magic in the future.
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PostSubject: Re: Production   Sun Apr 26, 2015 6:19 pm

Joe the Bartender wrote:
Patrick_the_Winekiller wrote:
I can see spider critters joining the swarm though, but maybe recoloured versions?

I will see what can be done when I get the time Arrow. Any thoughts on tiny melee Scarabs and Scorpions spawned by the bigger ones kind of like a Queen Spider?

Patrick_the_Winekiller wrote:
The Scartauri were later renamed to The Swarm. It is a definition of the creature that is half man half insect only though (not all the units The Swarm has).

Would you mind if I renamed the Scorpionman to Scartauri and Scorpionpriest to Scartauri Priest?
1. That would be great, but please bear in mind that the map is divided into squares no smaller than the one a normal unit occupies. Therefore, even if the graphic would be smaller, the selection circle, terrain pathing and all would still be 1 square (I suppose like a Sylph case?)
2. That's fine by me.

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PostSubject: Re: Production   Mon Apr 27, 2015 6:56 am

Considering Swarm little sons: I am absolutely ignorant if these will gives huge or none extra work, but here it goes anyway:
 
a) Is it possible or desirable, to have like a mini horde of swarm children in one unit (let’s say that some mini scarabs and some mini spider born out of swarm eggs, all those guys will count as one unit only);
b) Since we’ve got new spider and queen spider voice sets, we could have a mixture of the old ones ("a very best of") for these swarm egg units (1 ready, 1 select, 1 order).
c) They could have some kind of ability like poison or disease (perhaps this empowers them a lot).
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PostSubject: Re: Production   Mon May 11, 2015 11:44 pm

I forgot about Temples scratch. I'll add them to each side once they can be finalised. At the moment I'm not completely sure what they should do other than the Elemental and Snake Temple. The Elemental Temple is fine as is, but the others I never really liked since they tended to decrease balance and racial diversity.

I'd like to change the Snake Temple back into the Dragon Temple; I've got it producing the 2 dragons each race has access to but can change it to produce any dragon if that would be better.

The Infernal and Celestial Temples are much more complicated to me though, since they're more alignment-based than the others.


I'd also like to share another idea; restricted but tough generals (mini hero generals) vs default unit generals (or spammable generals, which is the current standard). I still believe there are more advantages to be had with restricted generals, but can understand there may be some which do not like the idea. The main reasons I'm suggesting this idea are:

  • It stops the 'spam generals' win condition which is still present with some races due to their respective generals' efficiency and/or special abilities.
  • Conversion spam promotes micromanagement wars and demotes tactical decisions (Elven Phoenix are the only exception as those races rely on them).
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PostSubject: Re: Production   Tue May 12, 2015 2:03 am

On the Temples discussion, I would like to add that TPC will have a Dragon Lair for each dragon type, like the current Frost Dragon Lair that can be seen in Chapter 1. Basically, each Lair will produce the designated dragon regardless of owner race, with the exception of Undead, which will always have an extra option to produce Dragon Liches. Since the dragon names & types are yet to be decided, so do their respective lairs, but the general idea is:

  • Frost Dragon Lair
  • Fire Dragon Lair
  • Swamp Dragon Lair
  • Storm Dragon Lair
  • Celestial Dragon Lair
  • Chaos Dragon Lair
  • Bone Dragon Lair
  • Night Dragon Lair
  • Gold Dragon Lair

Each will have a specific chance to spawn in a random map as well (in regards to the "Number of Temples" setting).

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PostSubject: Re: Production   Thu May 28, 2015 5:39 am

Sorry I didn't upload this sooner (time isn't on my side at the moment Rolling Eyes); here's all the latest stuff I've done/gathered. It includes the unit balancing, maps, unit AI, tower changes, production changes (including restricted generals, but these can be changed easily if not wanted) and renaming (excluding Summoner>Diabolist).

What it doesn't include are any of the newest units (a couple of them require hard-coded abilities etc) or the Horse or Golden Dragon models (the Horse is about 30% done, haven't started on Golden Dragon yet but should be easier and less time consuming). Temples are also unfinished and the Squire model hasn't been swapped with the Archer model yet (the model renaming is included in the Patchdata xcr anyway). Still I hope there's some useful stuff in there and that the balancing can be tested out more. afro
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PostSubject: Re: Production   Thu May 28, 2015 4:21 pm

Joe the Bartender wrote:
Still I hope there's some useful stuff in there and that the balancing can be tested out more. afro

I am going to test this out later. Just a small question: What do you want to do with those wav. files? We have already a collection of balanced sounds for 0.8.5 but I could replace (and rework the volumes, mandatory) whatever files you like. I personally think 0.8.5 temple ready sounds are better than yours and your manticor set sound is better than 0.8.5. Cool
Also BPFC.wav has no sound.
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PostSubject: Re: Production   Fri May 29, 2015 6:25 am

First of all: good work all together. There are some good improvements here. Now relax, and when you have the time, read it with a smoke and a drink. This is a big one:

I have played one match with all races, with a 0.8.4 32 level hero (+2/3 aristocracy), against Squire, lord and prince AI enemies. Not always I have built a titan. Some Wbc3, WBC1, WBC2 and Patrick’s inside pyramid terrain crushes the game (also, as you can tell,
I could not play with your SCN, so I have played always with bay of orcs, or random map grasslands).

Short Reading: (-) unable to develop multiple researches on more than one palace/keep/etc. (--) time production of global unit’s and game speed; (-) Status on some melee elite units; (-) heroes; (-) Dragon Cost/Status; (+++) building’s resistance; (+++) names/descriptions; (+) cost changes; (+) Fliers at level2; (+++) Floating units; (++++) Generals and level5 building, (++) Titan’s Cost/time production/status; (++) Death14 is actually working now (but cannot find that file anywhere)

Long way: All my words here should be read as positive/constructive comments and in no other way.
1. First impressions: I like name, unit place production, descriptions and some cost changes (although medium fliers such griffons, wyverns and Pegasus are very expensive and that compromises production). Also, I like the way buildings are stronger and you cannot destroy a tower with one Daemon only (g.e.). As negative points (and this is very important for me): This was the first time I put TPC on very fast (except daemons, dark dwarf, orc, ssrathi, minotaur, barbarians and swarm)... It reminds me a lot of the old incredible boring time structure of WBC3, when nothing happens... You are just there, waiting for a worker to be produced (I guess something with producing time here should be done) or someone to attack (squire/knight/lord/prince). In addition, after the second match, I decided to choose always very high resources… Another thing was damage: 0.8.4 had some fast battling system, this time it was drastically changed and the benefit was: buildings are tougher to destroy (Towers now actually have to be surrounded in order to be destroyed! Extremely positive aspect of the game. But if you have 3 or four infantry attacking a build recovering itself, then it is like nothing happens really), and in terms of units, you need to produce more to achieve the same results as 0.8.4 (Epic battles are less frequent with Prince AI and again, game is slower). A TPC skirmish game can last 20/25min, now it has a slow start and sometimes it extends unnecessarily time game play (again too much time waiting for workers and some basic units). This damage change also makes 0.8.4 Heroes… Super-Heroes once more like in the old WBC3 they run, they kill and they “lock and loll” big time (one thing I really disliked on WBC3 was duels with heroes: they kill everything and everyone and then battle until death, kind of strange IMO, although TPC makes them retreat, another positive aspect). One of the things I like the most in 0.8.4 is that your hero is actually some crucial strategic unit, and not some god-like guy killing hundreds of units. If old WBC3 needed drastic hero balance with other units, then now you got a small version of that issue once more here. Most powerful units in 0.8.4 had a clear distinction on damage and resistance (Doom Knights, Ancient Treants, Giants, etc). Now a Doom Knight has 25 damage base and a Wight 13… (I know there are other things to take into account, but still, I think these foes [Doom Knights, all Hydras] could contrast regular units, just like generals do). I actually miss 0.8.4 here… not to mention the number of killings you could do with these units… Global status on elite troops here is a negative point. I really like new ability to float for units such as: wraiths, shadows, etc. Fliers at level 2 is a good idea, but not sure about the gap on level 3 (it is a positive idea globally). Generals at level 5: I like it so much (strong, pricy and with high time production makes sense here). About Dragon Cost: I understand the concept, but prices are extremely high (we must not forget generals’ status and titan’s also. This is one aspect that increases unnecessary time waiting and forced me to fast forward), I would vote for a decrease on prices and augmenting their strength instead (Dragons should be strong but a quarter price a titan [450/550 x2resources]. I like resource changes on Dragons). 0.8.4 allows you to upgrade researches on every single Palace/keep/citadel/etc. this was a good improvement, now sadly lost.

2. Specific Comments, suggestions and whatever cannot fill what already has been said:
Knights: (++) Especially like paladins with electric damage. Suggestion: Swords are a little strong IMO (since there are so many ways you can summon/produce them).
Undead: (++++) Barrow building Wraiths/Shadows with very fast time production. That made my day! “bugs”: Barrow has no rally point and black library says it produces nothing (Bane should be)
Dwarf: (-) All units are very slow (should be faster than any siege weapon, I would had +2 speed to all). (+++) Dwarfs build faster than any other race so I guess worker’s building production place issue has been removed. (-) Catapults cannot catch cows conveniently… This cow/catapult speed affair is a Looney Tunes’ situation sometimes. Suggestion: I feel there is almost no distinction amongst berserker and khazrimi other than critical hits and damage type. Also, infantry upgrade is still broken but it deserves to be reincorporated when fixed.
Wood Elf: “bugs”: Oakman description says “Fey builder” but within tree of life is a wood elf infantry/builder. White tree says it requires level 4 but it is available at level 2. There is also an issue with Treant selection, see final picture (not sure if this is an effort to select more troops). (+++) Oakman! Yes! Finally you can fill mines with wood elves. (+) phoenix status are now ok. Suggestion: Does it make any sense turn white tree upgrades for Oakmen also (not armor)? I personally like archers on ranger’s guild like in 0.8.4. Ancient Wips and wisps have tons of resistance.
High Elf: “bugs” and Suggestion: wyverns and unicorns are back. The first I know it will be replaced, but I think Unicorns fit better Fey (they also empower Elves a lot with healing). Rune of vivos is there to unlock unicorns but in the future will unlock golden dragons, I suppose.
Dark Elf: “bugs”: kargothian gate is available level 2, it says is only at level 4 and consequently, meditation is only available at level4. Spiders now as swarm monsters. Suggestion: I would remove skeleton from tomb (you can build them with gravestone) and put there Spider priestess instead. I would also decrease spellcaster’s cost a bit, change assassins’ cost from gold to metal and blackguards from gold to stone instead in order to ease gold consumption. (++++) Love Dragonliche/Chaos Dragon combo!
Plague: (---) Generally speaking, I think they are weak now and the fun is over. A slime having 5 damage, a gazer 12 and a ghoul 15 is nothing (not speaking resistance and else). I feel Plaguelords are turning more like old WBC3 swarm or Plague. That is not good, I feel sad for that. 0.8.4 was better in my opinion. With such weak troops like that you aren’t going anywhere. This reminds me the old, sad, boring WBC3 once more: Plagues had no fun back then, Patrick made them interesting on 0.8.4. More: I have experienced a single Giant can kill my five hundred gazer, 3 thousand ghouls and a million more slimes. There is no way I can win a Prince/warlord AI with this race until I reach level 4/5 and build new hydras and dragons (but again, I have no resources to build one in the first place. I need to wait 10 min and suspend my production to build a titan or a dragon). I also feel undead Zombies are stronger than Plague zombies… Suggestion: Like all plague units, Hydras in particularly should have a boost on status (they die just like that against Ancient Treants or Giants. Perhaps getting closer to the other two would be ok). Things get worse: This is not as severe as 0.8.4, but consumption and production is now more depended on stone with hydras and eyes cost, so I think flaming eyes and cryohydras could cost gold/metal instead to ease crystal/stone burning (I need crystal for a Dragon!). Well, something should be done here. “Bug”: Plague of Shrine has a rally point. Like treants, Hydras have a problem when selection, see final pics (as treants, not sure if this is an effort to select more troops). (+) slime damage change. The same cave being able to produce all hydras is excellent (and Hydras not dependable on crystal), although for me the fun was lost already with infantry and gazer status. Sorry…
Daemon: (+++) To contrast Plague, these guys are globally better than 0.8.4! Especially imps are now something you can deal with. And I played with medium speed all time. Suggestion: bringing souls to production is not a bad idea, perhaps later inside chaos shrine with high cost and time (or a horde of souls instead of quasits).
Empire: (-) I can’t see why an elephant has lower army setup points than a Red mage and the same as a white one (because they are general yes, but I don’t know… look at ssrathi for instance. Makes more sense. This issue also exists on Plagues: Hydra/plague priests). (++) With this race I could research flaming arrows, upgrade one keep to level 3 and build some pikes and workers, all this starting with a very high income and a plaguelord elementalist hero (+0 altruism). “Bugs”: Library has a rally point. Suggestion: Why don’t you bring mages to the library once more? Just choose one as general (the red one?). They are also expensive as hell.
Swarm: (+++) Don’t mess with the swarm! This one was a surprise for me. The Swarm are fast on production (medium speed again) cheap and loads of units. Spiders are perfect here, very good. In no time I had warlords surrounded! I just can imagine playing with a Swarm hero and using its RSB. Scartauri’s names and room for spells, globally, I enjoyed it a lot. “Bugs”: Queen and watcher has a rally point. Suggestion: I see eggs releasing also ants (I use all swarm troops upon attack that is why I am proposing this). Somehow, Scartauri and Scartauri priest death sound is triceratops now… is this something planed?
Fey: (-) Researches not available on multiple buildings penalize Fey substantially and new units available on last dream hold only. Also, rate production should be faster (again I put game on very fast). (++) pixie madness issue solved at last. (+) fairy dragons and leprechauns available. (+++) Fliers level 2 benefits Fey a lot. Also keeping lore restrained by palace level is good. (--) Generals are very weak. Suggestion: here there is some dependence on crystal as well. Perhaps turning lore, zephyr and panoply researches to stone, metal or gold. Also changing some unit’s resource-cost other than crystal.
Ssrathi: (++) like dwarves, workers building place issue solved by fast timing on construction. (++) Generally I like it: Basilisk, strong warriors and good time on production (medium speed again). See? Hydras’ production should be constant like dinosaurs here. (-) Snake priests researches are still crazy. They raze down a base and no one notices (“your base has been destroyed!”). “Bugs” Naga causes no fear since 0.8.3. Triceratops with same problem as treants and hydras. See picture.
Orc: (+++) Trolls are back! (+) Giant Status (avoid psychological warfare and highly resistance). Good production rate (medium speed). (++) wolfrider with wardog death sound. Good idea (I missed that)! Suggestion: researches on different buildings could be helpful here (Kobolds/snipers).
Minotaur: (+++) medium speed, Minotaurs against orcs, daemon and barbarians=Epicness. Basilisks highly resistant. Suggestion: what about cows? “Bugs”: Where are frost bats? Removed? The bat description is not readable.
Barbarian: (+++) medium speed, everything is very positive.
Dark Dwarf: (++) another globally better than 0.8.4. (+++) workers issue solved as ssrathi and dwarves. (-) the only thing I have to say is: catapults have already long range (towers cannot hit them). Dwarven towers has a +4 range. Is not that a little too much just like snake priests? Those catapults burn a base in seconds.
Temples: right now earth elementals can destroy every building in its path. It is worth a look.

3.Conclusion: Despite all positive aspects already mentioned, I have clearly to point out, even knowing my hero has +2/3 aristocracy: Speed/ Time is something should be thought here (I felt it more with Fey, Plague, Knights and Dwarves specially). Perhaps global decrease on infantry production rate and/or cost (They are so “cannon meat”…) + bringing back multiple researches in different Keeps? And plaguelords…
Good work globally speaking nonetheless!

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PostSubject: Re: Production   Sun May 31, 2015 2:52 am

Zetoo wrote:
BPFC.wav has no sound
I believe this is a bug. The sound is located in SoundFX.xcr, but the building refuses to play it and plays the default Plaguelord tower sound instead.

Zetoo wrote:
32 level hero (+2/3 aristocracy)
Which hero were you playing with? I'd recommend playtesting with level 10 or lower heroes of same race and a class designed  for that race. Although not quite the terror they were in vanilla, level 32 heroes are still quite powerful and can give warped impressions of a match. I'd also recommend not investing in any Perks for testing purposes, particularly Aristocrat vs Plutocrat as that's currently unbalanced afaik.

Zetoo wrote:
Some Wbc3, WBC1, WBC2 and Patrick’s inside pyramid terrain crushes the game
Is there some more bugs with the WBC1/2 tilesets?

Zetoo wrote:
It reminds me a lot of the old incredible boring time structure of WBC3, when nothing happens... You are just there, waiting for a worker to be produced
now it has a slow start and sometimes it extends unnecessarily time game play
I'll take another look at it, though this is not helped by the current player-avoiding AI. What other players were in the skirmish? Was there any mid-map mine-scraping mini wars?

Zetoo wrote:
Another thing was damage: 0.8.4 had some fast battling system, this time it was drastically changed and the benefit was: buildings are tougher to destroy
It also stretched battles out more so armies didn't die in seconds and put value back into warrior style heroes.

Zetoo wrote:
This damage change also makes 0.8.4 Heroes… Super-Heroes once more like in the old WBC3 they run, they kill and they “lock and loll” big time
I've honestly not had a problem with this. My lvl 7 Ssrathi Dragonslayer was frequently getting mashed by a variety of different units. The other thing here is essentially a debate between "above unit" heroes vs "unit" heroes. I probably prefer the former just because it's the one and only hero and because it stops warriors from being useless (buff mages and merchants ruled 0.8.4). That said, it could be happening because items have become too powerful by comparison to the new meta.

Zetoo wrote:
Now a Doom Knight has 25 damage base and a Wight 13… (I know there are other things to take into account, but still, I think these foes [Doom Knights, all Hydras] could contrast regular units, just like generals do)
Temples: right now earth elementals can destroy every building in its path. It is worth a look.
This stuff is mostly based on a unit's army cap cost (which makes the problem with the Earth Elemental, I know. That guy will require some thinking to sort out. Atm he just costs extra time for nearly double power of the 2 army cap elementals). I'm thinking maybe Doom Knights should be 2AC units instead.

Zetoo wrote:
About Dragon Cost: I understand the concept, but prices are extremely high (we must not forget generals’ status and titan’s also. This is one aspect that increases unnecessary time waiting and forced me to fast forward)
Despite some newly found power they probably will require a cost cut.

Zetoo wrote:
0.8.4 allows you to upgrade researches on every single Palace/keep/citadel/etc. this was a good improvement, now sadly lost.
I thought I had this lot implemented – which sides haven't got this feature?

Zetoo wrote:
Swords are a little strong IMO
I think the damage may need to go down to ~10.

Zetoo wrote:
Dwarf: (-) All units are very slow
Aye, I'll test out +1 first.

Zetoo wrote:
I feel there is almost no distinction amongst berserker and khazrimi other than critical hits and damage type.
And costs, speed, armour and resistance (also special vulnerabilities/resistances too).

Zetoo wrote:
Also, infantry upgrade is still broken but it deserves to be reincorporated when fixed.
I doubt this is going to be fixable short of a new axethrower unit.

Zetoo wrote:
Oakman description says “Fey builder”
This problem exists with many other units too Sad. I don't know if it can be fixed but I'll try.

Zetoo wrote:
Love Dragonliche/Chaos Dragon combo!
Ahkkk, this was supposed to be Dragonliche/Storm Dragon sorry Embarassed (and eventually Night Dragon/ Storm Dragon). I already had them set to receive the Storm Dragon instead of the Chaos Dragon due to their more organised evil nature.

Zetoo wrote:
A slime having 5 damage
Perhaps it should start with 8-10 magic damage and be upgradable to 15?

Zetoo wrote:
gazer 12
I'll be tweaking this back up in future versions. They do currently spawn 4 Slimes on death though (I'd rather only the Spore did that really).

Zetoo wrote:
ghoul 15 is nothing (not speaking resistance and else)
The Zombie-esque resistance/vulnerability plus the upgradability makes this unit. They're seriously tough too. I never found them unfun to use myself Surprised.

Zetoo wrote:
I have experienced a single Giant can kill my five hundred gazer, 3 thousand ghouls and a million more slimes
Because it's a Giant + the old vanilla healing upon level up problem is still here. Giants and Dragons are the biggest culprits of this problem in the game. It's also one of the reasons why Dragons cost that much, even back in vanilla. If that got fixed, this wouldn't be a problem anymore. I believe the code is available in 1.03.23 bounce.

Zetoo wrote:
I also feel undead Zombies are stronger than Plague zombies
Because Feast of Garok?

Zetoo wrote:
Hydras in particularly should have a boost on status
Hydras are 2AC units which have been designed to compare with Knights/Knight Champions. Ancient Treants and particularly Giants are way above the quality of standard Hydras. You need Cryohydras and Pyrohydras for that job and even then the Giant will be seriously dangerous as it's a 4AC general which heals on level up.

Zetoo wrote:
consumption and production is now more depended on stone with hydras and eyes cost, so I think flaming eyes and cryohydras could cost gold/metal instead
It's so a Plaguelord player can't combine Flamers with Hydras so easily but will give it a check. I don't really want the entire Plaguelord army to just be Flamers and various Hydras.

Zetoo wrote:
Why don’t you bring mages to the library once more? Just choose one as general (the red one?)
It's a good idea though it would screw up the Call Sage spell Sad.

Zetoo wrote:
Somehow, Scartauri and Scartauri priest death sound is triceratops now… is this something planed?
Thought it suited better Smile.

Zetoo wrote:
(-) Researches not available on multiple buildings penalize Fey substantially and new units available on last dream hold only. Also, rate production should be faster
(--) Generals are very weak
I will need to look into this more. It depends whether the global unit access to all level 1 dreamholds will become broken or not at the moment.

Zetoo wrote:
some dependence on crystal as well. Perhaps turning lore, zephyr and panoply researches to stone, metal or gold. Also changing some unit’s resource-cost other than crystal
Maybe. Depends whether cutting Gemcutting from the Fey hero has worked scratch. The AI may be a problem here too.

Zetoo wrote:
(-) Snake priests researches are still crazy. They raze down a base and no one notices
Nuts, I thought I had this sorted lol!. I think there's a combination of factors here, like the exponential HP buff via Cauterize, the Scarab-like firepower with too much range and above all its accessibility at tier 2 despite being more like a tier 3 unit. I do have a plan in mind to fix this guy forever though – perhaps a damage decrease to 10-12 and a range decrease down to 4 (so it would have 10 with all upgrades instead of 11 or 12 in vanilla. That might make it feel more like a tier 2 unit again).

Zetoo wrote:
Dwarven towers has a +4 range
Don't remember giving them +4 range, will look into it.

Zetoo wrote:
Those catapults burn a base in seconds.
I'm not sure it's that bad. Decreasing their damage down to 40 has helped a lot. All they need now is half damage vs units, no crits and maybe a small range decrease and these should finally stop being a problem.

Zetoo wrote:
There is also an issue with Treant selection, see final picture
Like treants, Hydras have a problem when selection, see final pics
Triceratops with same problem as treants and hydras
These are known. These units dropped down to an AC cost of 2 for balancing reasons.

Zetoo wrote:
“bugs”: Barrow has no rally point
Does it make any sense turn white tree upgrades for Oakmen also
“Bug”: Plague of Shrine has a rally point.
“Bugs”: Library has a rally point.
Patrick will need to implement this stuff if the balancing gets accepted. These require the source code I believe.

Zetoo wrote:
black library says it produces nothing (Bane should be)
Catapults cannot catch cows conveniently
White tree says it requires level 4 but it is available at level 2
“bugs”: kargothian gate is available level 2, it says is only at level 4 and consequently, meditation is only available at level4
Spiders now as swarm monsters
I can’t see why an elephant has lower army setup points than a Red mage and the same as a white one
This issue also exists on Plagues: Hydra/plague priests
“Bugs” Naga causes no fear since 0.8.3
“Bugs”: Where are frost bats? Removed? The bat description is not readable.
Thanks for the spots! These will be fixed in a new version. Smile
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PostSubject: Re: Production   Sun May 31, 2015 3:49 am

Joe T.B. wrote:
Is there some more bugs with the WBC1/2 tilesets?
Erasing Patch.xcr helps obviously. Your Scnearios are great, they should be on the next release. That also inspired me on making some for a final campaign and i find some bugs. I am trying to make a scenario with Pyramid-Sand, Pyramid-Walls, Sand Bridge. The first two have no “tiny picture” (and that really helps). Sand Bridge is an enigma so far… I can’t actually make a Bridge out of the 4 samples provided.

EDIT: oops, I have edit this instead of quoting....


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PostSubject: Re: Production   Sun May 31, 2015 5:30 am

The crashes are being caused when the AI play as Fey, Plaguelords or Undead. I'm not sure why at the moment, it could be that I've messed up Building.cfg Surprised. Patrick will probably know more about it.

I think this is the official BPFC.wav.

Zetoo wrote:
All races: I cannot research something that requires level 3 on a level 1 palace (g.e.)
My bad, sorry about that pale. It will be sorted! Smile

Zetoo wrote:
My fault, I mean Dark Dwarven catapults have this upgrade to +4 range. Maybe too much now. Just saying.
Ahh right bounce. I'll see if cutting their range down to 12 will help. If that doesn't sort it, I'll blame the research! lol!
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PostSubject: Re: Production   Sun May 31, 2015 6:09 pm

Joe the Bartender wrote:
I think this is the official BPFC.wav.

I am missing something: Why should this file be restored? It was never played/used before (TPC/WBC3. I think so!). The only thing I did was cutting down some bass-low regions, an effort I did to most files to avoid a global distortion when they play all together.

Edit: It does play correctly for Fire Cave on 0.8.4/0.8.5 TPC.


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PostSubject: Re: Production   Sun May 31, 2015 7:26 pm

When selected, does the Fire Cave play the Plaguelord Tower sound for you? I keep getting that and I've no idea why pale. I think I remember this happening in vanilla too.
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PostSubject: Re: Production   Sun May 31, 2015 7:33 pm

The building rally points are set up in building.cfg. Simply add the corresponding race letter to ARMIES? section. I'll have a look into the crashes with the Fey, Undead and Plaguelord when I get the time.

Also, I hope someone is keeping a log of all these changes...

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Kharn
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PostSubject: Re: Production   Sun May 31, 2015 10:11 pm

Joe wrote:

Zetoo wrote:

Oakman description says “Fey builder”
This problem exists with many other units too Sad. I don't know if it can be fixed but I'll try.

The game actually supports changing names / descriptions based on race. Take a look at the Zombie for example:

[AUBX_Name] ZOMBIE
[AUBX_Desc_G] Basic Plague builder
[AUBX_Desc] Basic Undead builder
[AUBX_Requ] Requires: Nothing
[AUBX_HKey] z
[AUBX_Lin1] ZOMBIE (Undead Builder)
[AUBX_Lin2] Abilities: Build Skill 8, Disease Can be added to mines
[AUBX_Lin3] vs. ground troops only

As seen on the second and third line, the Zombie changes from Undead builder to Plague builder. So for the Oakman (and others) simply copy the line you want to change but then add the race's letter in the string, then change the text to what you want it to say for that race only.
I'm sure you know what each race's "letter" is. Smile
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PostSubject: Re: Production   Mon Jun 01, 2015 12:16 am

Kharn wrote:
The game actually supports changing names / descriptions based on race.
Surprisingly, this works with buildings, units AND researches.

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PostSubject: Re: Production   Mon Jun 01, 2015 1:29 am

Joe the Bartender wrote:
When selected, does the Fire Cave play the Plaguelord Tower sound for you?

Current 0.8.5 sounds have no such problem. I can only guess it is something wrong on your side. scratch

Patrick wrote:
Also, I hope someone is keeping a log of all these changes...
I could make it after Joe's final version comes to town.
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PostSubject: Re: Production   Tue Jun 02, 2015 8:31 pm

Ah, and if you could give some descriptions to new buildings, boats and shipyard would be awesome.
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Joe the Bartender
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PostSubject: Re: Production   Wed Jun 03, 2015 6:15 am

I'll try. Which new buildings are included in 0.8.5?

Is the Night Dragon done? I would like to start implementing all the new units and upload the next version. I'm not sure if I can get the Horse/Golden Dragon done in time or not though bounce. The Halcyon Phoenix is currently in-game whilst the unnamed mini Celestial Dragon, Umbral Phoenix, Lodestar Wisp and Will-o-wisp all need to be converted to WBC3's palette system. I believe I can also add baby Scarabs and Scorpions too. When it comes to the Scarabs I might try to make a little swarm group for them and see how that turns out.
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